Heather,
I wouldn't exactly want us to think of libraries or even universities as
"boot camps," but I guess my point is that it's also a mistake to think
of them as day care centers or kindergartens. Playing is important for
our development at some stage, but there's also a stage when we have to
be challenged to do hard work.
That's not to say we should make the work as hard as possible, as boot
camps do, because "toughness" is not really what libraries or
universities are primarily trying to inculcate. Learning should be fun
and exciting, to some extent at least. But to expect it to be totally
"seamless" is probably asking too much. Learning can be hard, and
sometimes we run into "seams" that require us to go to "experts" like
librarians or professors for help.
Those seams may be necessary because certain elements of knowledge can't
be translated easily into something else. So for example, subject
concepts can't be translated easily into the words that happened to be
used in documents about them. We'll probably find them more easily with
subject searches than with keyword searches.
There may be no way to automate subject assignment because our
relationship with words is different from computers' relationship with
them. Computers are good at scanning documents for character
strings--can do that a lot more efficiently than we can. But words mean
more to us than strings of characters, because we can also visualize the
things they're about and see similarities to other related things in the
world.
--Ted Gemberling
Not an official statement of the UAB Lister Hill Library
-----Original Message-----
From: Next generation catalogs for libraries
[mailto:NGC4LIB_at_LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Scalf, Heather H
Sent: Friday, May 04, 2007 1:38 PM
To: NGC4LIB_at_LISTSERV.ND.EDU
Subject: Re: [NGC4LIB] Yes but
Ted,
Having been in the military, I found your analogy interesting, but not
inappropriate. The one comment I would offer is that boot camp is a
requirement for admission to the military "group," As much as most of
us would like to make library instruction mandatory, I think we all
struggle with being included on the list of "suggested" courses, much
less mandated. If only....
Heather Scalf
UT Arlington
To use another (possibly
inappropriate) analogy, boot camp is presumably not very "user
friendly." But apparently it's a way the armed services have found
useful for creating soldiers.
As for user studies, it seems it would be important to distinguish
between various populations in evaluating what users want. There's
probably one pattern for freshman and another for seniors in college.
Maybe still another for graduate students. We all enjoy looking at
Wikipedia, but many professors prohibit students from citing it in
papers. So they have to learn to use sources that are harder to find.
The harder to find ones are often more authoritative.
I realize the point I made in the second paragraph may be a familiar
thing. I just thought it was worth repeating here.
--Ted Gemberling, UAB Lister Hill Library
-----Original Message-----
From: Next generation catalogs for libraries
[mailto:NGC4LIB_at_LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of MULLEN Allen
Sent: Friday, May 04, 2007 12:34 PM
To: NGC4LIB_at_LISTSERV.ND.EDU
Subject: Re: [NGC4LIB] Yes but
Hank Young writes:
>I question that it is possible to create a system that will
>give good results for more than 30% of the population without
>educating them in how to use the tool.
What are "good results" and who determines them? Where does the 30%
come from? What do assumptions about an unknown proportion of the
Spanish-speaking population of southern California ("the writer
mentioned some of the strongest supporters were Hispanics" is vague - it
seems to me that some of the strongest supporters of bilingual education
are also Hispanics, the biases of the writer are not specified, there is
no data provided to support this, etc.) add to this discussion other
than something along the lines of some people like orange juice and some
people like grape juice?
State of the art in the Internet world - good results are demonstrated
by a level of use (by users) that out competes other systems providing
the same service. In the library world, good results are mostly
demonstrated by vendor systems that provide what librarians ask for on
behalf of users who have little or no choices or involvement, or by
system designers who develop systems on behalf of users with varying
perspectives on "users". Both approaches are user-centered - we all
care about "users" (as vast and diverse as that term encompasses).
Being a third-way person by nature, I'd say that real competition (with
a user motive, not a profit motive) would be helpful for patrons in the
library world- that is the ability for users to choose to use the local
bibliographic systems or an alternatives.
Allen
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Next generation catalogs for libraries
>[mailto:NGC4LIB_at_listserv.nd.edu] On Behalf Of Hank Young
>Sent: Friday, May 04, 2007 9:57 AM
>To: NGC4LIB_at_listserv.nd.edu
>Subject: Re: [NGC4LIB] Yes but
>
>Bravo!
>
>I question that it is possible to create a system that will
>give good results for more than 30% of the population without
>educating them in how to use the tool. Many librarians
>consider what they do to be educational by its nature.
>
> - Hank Young
>University of Florida
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Next generation catalogs for libraries
>[mailto:NGC4LIB_at_LISTSERV.ND.EDU] On Behalf Of Ted P Gemberling
>Sent: Friday, May 04, 2007 12:39 PM
>To: NGC4LIB_at_LISTSERV.ND.EDU
>Subject: [NGC4LIB] Yes but
>
>I hate to make a "yes but" point, but I think this other
>perspective might be worth considering. I believe library
>systems have to be user-centered (accessible), adjusted to the
>needs of users. But remember that users have to adjust
>themselves to information, too. That is part of learning.
>
><snip>
>
> --Ted Gemberling, UAB Lister Hill Library, Birmingham, Ala.
>
Received on Mon May 07 2007 - 01:56:09 EDT